New KJ, I have some questions

[wiseguy]

Trump's base is comparatively small. It consists of the least intelligent Americans. Fools who will lap up anything as long as it plays to their fears and bigotry. Trump will never get the Latino vote, the African American vote, the Muslim vote, or the women's vote. The only way he would have a ghost of a chance is if voter turnout was incredibly low. But that isn't going to happen. People will come out in record numbers to make sure a POS like Trump does not become their president.

The trouble is wiseguy Trump has really blurred the lines between left and right. Some of his positions are quite Liberal in fact, that is why some of the old main stream Conservatives say they won't support him. Because of his stance he might just be able to solve the Social Security problem, which has been stalemated for the last 8 years of partisan politics. His isolationist position puts him at odds with the neocons of the Republican Party. Actually Hillary is more of a Hawk than he is. He is all over the board and some of his positions and statements contradict one another. I'm not even sure if he knows what his position will be day to day. He has alienated so many groups, and yet he does have support with swing voters and independents, who simply want a change, and our tired of both parties, saying one thing and then business as usual. Trump has really tapped into the general voter dissatisfaction, just like Bernie has. It has been said that their supporters are just flip sides of the same coin. Voters who are fed up with both parties, wanting a change.

I just can't see how any of this matters. It's considered a given that the presidency cannot now be won without a significant percentage of the minority vote. What could Trump possibly do to gain minority support at this point. Hell, even Romney could only garner 17% of the minority vote and did nothing close to what Trump has done to alienate them. Then there's the women voters. Some credible political pundits believe that women will be likely be the deciding factor in this election. What chance does Trump have against Hillary in securing women voters? No... I just can't see any way Trump can even make a decent showing in the general. I'm looking forward to the biggest blowout in history.

[The Lone Ranger]

I just can't see how any of this matters. It's considered a given that the presidency cannot now be won without a significant percentage of the minority vote. What could Trump possibly do to gain minority support at this point. Hell, even Romney could only garner 17% of the minority vote and did nothing close to what Trump has done to alienate them. Then there's the women voters. Some credible political pundits believe that women will be likely be the deciding factor in this election. What chance does Trump have against Hillary in securing women voters? No... I just can't see any way Trump can even make a decent showing in the general. I'm looking forward to the biggest blowout in history.

You are talking about conventional politically thinking, Trump is anything but conventional. If you would have asked a year ago what his chances were to win the Republican party nomination most pundits would have said zero. There were governors, senators and former members of the House running against him with combined political experience totaling over a 137 years. He beat all of them with no political resume whatsoever. This is not the year of the insider, people are fed up with what they see as a corrupt political system, that favors the 1% over the rest of us. They are tired of spending our treasure, and lives supporting wars without end, that accomplish destabilizing the very countries we are trying to pacify. Trump this morning said he wants to raise taxes on the 1%, effectively raising his own taxes. He is selling the dog food that the public wants. His opponents brands are still sitting on the shelf. Hillary's task is harder because she has been around so long that she is part of the status quo he rails against. Sanders has not helped matters lately, Trump is using his material to attack Clinton.
Poor Hillary is still fighting a two front war, while Trump can concentrate attacks on her. I don't like Trump, but things right now are going his way and it will not be the walk in the park everyone on the Democratic side are hoping for.

[wiseguy]

I just can't see how any of this matters. It's considered a given that the presidency cannot now be won without a significant percentage of the minority vote. What could Trump possibly do to gain minority support at this point. Hell, even Romney could only garner 17% of the minority vote and did nothing close to what Trump has done to alienate them. Then there's the women voters. Some credible political pundits believe that women will be likely be the deciding factor in this election. What chance does Trump have against Hillary in securing women voters? No... I just can't see any way Trump can even make a decent showing in the general. I'm looking forward to the biggest blowout in history.

You are talking about conventional politically thinking, Trump is anything but conventional. If you would have asked a year ago what his chances were to win the Republican party nomination most pundits would have said zero. There were governors, senators and former members of the House running against him with combined political experience totaling over a 137 years. He beat all of them with no political resume whatsoever. This is not the year of the insider, people are fed up with what they see as a corrupt political system, that favors the 1% over the rest of us. They are tired of spending our treasure, and lives supporting wars without end, that accomplish destabilizing the very countries we are trying to pacify. Trump this morning said he wants to raise taxes on the 1%, effectively raising his own taxes. He is selling the dog food that the public wants. His opponents brands are still sitting on the shelf. Hillary's task is harder because she has been around so long that she is part of the status quo he rails against. Sanders has not helped matters lately, Trump is using his material to attack Clinton.
Poor Hillary is still fighting a two front war, while Trump can concentrate attacks on her. I don't like Trump, but things right now are going his way and it will not be the walk in the park everyone on the Democratic side are hoping for.

Actually, I'm talking about facts. Even if every single thing you say is true the fact remains that Trump cannot win without the support of minority and women voters. The general election is nothing like the primaries. Trump turned out to be the dominate clown in the GOP clown car but he will not be the dominant candidate in the general election... far from it. He's going to get crushed.

[The Lone Ranger]

Actually, I'm talking about facts. Even if every single thing you say is true the fact remains that Trump cannot win without the support of minority and women voters. The general election is nothing like the primaries. Trump turned out to be the dominate clown in the GOP clown car but he will not be the dominant candidate in the general election... far from it. He's going to get crushed.

All I'm saying wiseguy is that it is a big mistake to make plans to fight the current war on what happened in the war before. That is why the Allies failed in the early going of WWII, they thought it would be fought like WWI. They were surprised when the Germans came out with Lighting Warfare tactics. Trump is a different kind of candidate than the experienced political hacks were used to and he cleaned their clocks. He is a master at selling, he really has no core values like more established candidates. He can change his message on a dime, he is the insulting sultan of dirty politics. Sometimes half truths can Trump facts if you excuse the pun.

The one fact that matters the most is the people are tired of business as usual, they want a change. Both Trump and Bernie were the messengers of change, and some of the message was similar, that why it attracts voters who feel they have been left out, and want some of the goodies. They don't feel that the playing field is level and fair. If this continues through a few more election cycles the ruling class will eventually be shaking in their collective boots. This problem in the Republican Party is not only a wake up call for them, but for all America. Paul Ryan has still not come out and said he is supporting Trump. There are many Republicans that have joined the Libertarians since it became apparent Trump will be the standard bearer. Hillary will have a similar problem rallying Sanders supporters to her standard.

I'm glad that you are so sure Trump will be crushed, I still feel it is a big mistake to take him for granted. Hillary will have to bring her A game against him to win, I just hope that is going to be enough.

[wiseguy]

Actually, I'm talking about facts. Even if every single thing you say is true the fact remains that Trump cannot win without the support of minority and women voters. The general election is nothing like the primaries. Trump turned out to be the dominate clown in the GOP clown car but he will not be the dominant candidate in the general election... far from it. He's going to get crushed.

All I'm saying wiseguy is that it is a big mistake to make plans to fight the current war on what happened in the war before. That is why the Allies failed in the early going of WWII, they thought it would be fought like WWI. They were surprised when the Germans came out with Lighting Warfare tactics. Trump is a different kind of candidate than the experienced political hacks were used to and he cleaned their clocks. He is a master at selling, he really has no core values like more established candidates. He can change his message on a dime, he is the insulting sultan of dirty politics. Sometimes half truths can Trump facts if you excuse the pun.

The one fact that matters the most is the people are tired of business as usual, they want a change. Both Trump and Bernie were the messengers of change, and some of the message was similar, that why it attracts voters who feel they have been left out, and want some of the goodies. They don't feel that the playing field is level and fair. If this continues through a few more election cycles the ruling class will eventually be shaking in their collective boots. This problem in the Republican Party is not only a wake up call for them, but for all America. Paul Ryan has still not come out and said he is supporting Trump. There are many Republicans that have joined the Libertarians since it became apparent Trump will be the standard bearer. Hillary will have a similar problem rallying Sanders supporters to her standard.

I'm glad that you are so sure Trump will be crushed, I still feel it is a big mistake to take him for granted. Hillary will have to bring her A game against him to win, I just hope that is going to be enough.

I agree that people are tired of business as usual... but you don't go and eat garbage out of the dumpster because you don't like the way the restaurant prepared your food. I still have faith in American voters. I refuse to accept that they would elect a bigoted, racist, misogynistic, unqualified, reality tv star, as their president.

[The Lone Ranger]

I agree that people are tired of business as usual... but you don't go and eat garbage out of the dumpster because you don't like the way the restaurant prepared your food. I still have faith in American voters. I refuse to accept that they would elect a bigoted, racist, misogynistic, unqualified, reality tv star, as their president.

I hope you are right wiseguy. My favorite quote is by Winston Churchill who was half American on his Mother's side. He said "Americans will always do the right thing, after they have tried everything else". I just hope one of the things they don't try is 4 years with The Donald.

[The Lone Ranger]

Just a quick PS. This is not a choice of eating garbage out of a dumpster or eating at a restaurant, if you have the money to go to any restaurant, you can choose which one to eat at. You only have to eat out of the dumpster if you have no choice and it is a matter of survival. Like Obama said you have a choice chicken or beef. In trump's case it might be baloney, some people like baloney.

[wiseguy]

Just a quick PS. This is not a choice of eating garbage out of a dumpster or eating at a restaurant, if you have the money to go to any restaurant, you can choose which one to eat at. You only have to eat out of the dumpster if you have no choice and it is a matter of survival. Like Obama said you have a choice chicken or beef. In trump's case it might be baloney, some people like baloney.

I think you misunderstood my analogy. I was basically saying that just because you're tired of a "business as usual" politician like Hillary it doesn't mean you should stoop to voting for a totally unqualified, racist, blowhard like Trump.

I watched Rob Reiner get in a heated discussion on Morning Joe the other day when he called Trump supporters racists. When called on that remark he recanted saying "no, not all of them". I would have said "yes, all of them". Who else would support a candidate who is so blatantly obvious a racist bigot?

Any way you want to look at this upcoming election the only way Trump has the slightest chance is to change his current standing with minorities and women. Tell me how he's going to do that. It is much more likely that he will say things to alienate them even more. The depth of his narcissism will not allow him to be anything other than what he is.

[The Lone Ranger]

I think you misunderstood my analogy. I was basically saying that just because you're tired of a "business as usual" politician like Hillary it doesn't mean you should stoop to voting for a totally unqualified, racist, blowhard like Trump.

I watched Rob Reiner get in a heated discussion on Morning Joe the other day when he called Trump supporters racists. When called on that remark he recanted saying "no, not all of them". I would have said "yes, all of them". Who else would support a candidate who is so blatantly obvious a racist bigot?

Any way you want to look at this upcoming election the only way Trump has the slightest chance is to change his current standing with minorities and women. Tell me how he's going to do that. It is much more likely that he will say things to alienate them even more. The depth of his narcissism will not allow him to be anything other than what he is.

Just like some conservatives wouldn't stoop to vote for Bernie Sanders, since they don't know what a Democratic Socialist is, they think he is a Communist. Funny though many of Trumps and Sanders views are similar. In fact Trump is more radical than Sanders say on Foreign Policy, he is an isolationist "America First person, where Sanders thinks we need to stay active and work with our allies. On matters concerning Social Security and Medicare both of them want to improve these vital social programs, for future generations. They both are in favor of a single payer universal health care delivery system. In a general election where voters can cross party lines Trump could pick up some of the Sanders supporters.

I watched the same show, Mr. Reiner was getting on Joe's case for not pushing Trump hard on questions. Joe pointed out that you can ask the question over and over and the candidate isn't required to give you a definite answer. Look how many people have ducked the question on whether they endorse Trump? Kelly A the Senator said she didn't endorse Trump, but she supports him, say what? If that isn't double talk I don't know what is. I don't doubt that racists do support Trump, and that it may upset rank and file regular Republicans that this element is attracted to their party. Really can they expect any other of outcome since conservative talk radio has fostered this type of support for years? The chickens are just coming home to roost.

You forget to win the electoral college all Trump has to do is keep the current red states red and pickup Michigan, Pennsylvania and Ohio, where he is running ahead in these rust belt states. The final election will come down to a few battle ground states as usual. California and New York will stay blue, just like Texas and most of the South will stay red, the country is that polarized.

[wiseguy]

You forget to win the electoral college all Trump has to do is keep the current red states red and pickup Michigan, Pennsylvania and Ohio, where he is running ahead in these rust belt states. The final election will come down to a few battle ground states as usual. California and New York will stay blue, just like Texas and most of the South will stay red, the country is that polarized.

I hate to keep harping on this but Trump cannot possibly pick up those states without the support of minorities and women. When someone can convince me that he can turn these groups around then I'll start worrying.

[The Lone Ranger]

I hate to keep harping on this but Trump cannot possibly pick up those states without the support of minorities and women. When someone can convince me that he can turn these groups around then I'll start worrying.

You keep talking about facts have you seen the latest polls from the states I have mentioned? While Hillary is leading nationally, she is behind currently in these states by about 6 to 7 points. Granted there is a long way to go before election day, and if we selected the President by popular vote, I would say you are right. We have instead this Electoral College system, which in my opinion should be abolished, and the President should be elected by the popular vote like most Democracies are. Also we have the problems of voter suppression in this country since the Supreme Court has weakened the Voting Rights Act.

[Bigdog]

Just a quick PS. This is not a choice of eating garbage out of a dumpster or eating at a restaurant, if you have the money to go to any restaurant, you can choose which one to eat at. You only have to eat out of the dumpster if you have no choice and it is a matter of survival. Like Obama said you have a choice chicken or beef. In trump's case it might be baloney, some people like baloney.

I think you misunderstood my analogy. I was basically saying that just because you're tired of a "business as usual" politician like Hillary it doesn't mean you should stoop to voting for a totally unqualified, racist, blowhard like Trump.

I watched Rob Reiner get in a heated discussion on Morning Joe the other day when he called Trump supporters racists. When called on that remark he recanted saying "no, not all of them". I would have said "yes, all of them". Who else would support a candidate who is so blatantly obvious a racist bigot?

Any way you want to look at this upcoming election the only way Trump has the slightest chance is to change his current standing with minorities and women. Tell me how he's going to do that. It is much more likely that he will say things to alienate them even more. The depth of his narcissism will not allow him to be anything other than what he is.

Why do you say it's a race thing...typical democratic thinking..... 14 million illegal aliens are a drain on our economy ...doesn't matter their race....I don't care if they're white....how many terrorists have crossed over the border already.... Terrorists killing anyone that isn't their idea of religion isn't racist to want to kill them. Trump wants to fix a problem the democrats refuse to even acknowledge.. That's not racist, it's common sense. Trump doesn't have a problem with women...his big deal was the fight with Rosie O.... Democrats are spinning it to include all women... Abortion has always been a hot topic for 100 years... Who has the right answer? Nobody yet...
As far as Hilary is concerned.... Her closet has more head stones than Arlington.. He will make her look like the snake she is... I'd be ok with trump sanders ticket...he'll get his votes and still be able to control him..anything to beat Hilary...

[wiseguy]

Why do you say it's a race thing...typical democratic thinking..... 14 million illegal aliens are a drain on our economy ...doesn't matter their race....I don't care if they're white....how many terrorists have crossed over the border already.... Terrorists killing anyone that isn't their idea of religion isn't racist to want to kill them. Trump wants to fix a problem the democrats refuse to even acknowledge.. That's not racist, it's common sense. Trump doesn't have a problem with women...his big deal was the fight with Rosie O.... Democrats are spinning it to include all women... Abortion has always been a hot topic for 100 years... Who has the right answer? Nobody yet...
As far as Hilary is concerned.... Her closet has more head stones than Arlington.. He will make her look like the snake she is... I'd be ok with trump sanders ticket...he'll get his votes and still be able to control him..anything to beat Hilary...

Bigdog, stay away from sharp objects or you might burst that bubble you live in where facts don't matter and the only things you believe are the things you want to believe. Undocumented immigrants are NOT a drain on our economy but exactly the opposite. You tell me how many terrorists have crossed over our borders already... if you know... you're the only one who does. I can tell you this. You are much more likely to be killed by a toddler getting their hands on a gun then you are by a terrorist. Maybe we should deport all toddlers. You think the Rosie O'donnell incident is the only incident Trump has had with women? What about what he said about Megan Kelly, Ariana Huffington, and Carly Fiorina. What about what he said about his own daughter. He has a long, well documented, history of degrading women. Trump is a bigot, a racist, a misogynist, and a serial liar. He isn't qualified to be the mayor of a small town let alone president of the United States.

[The Lone Ranger]

Why do you say it's a race thing...typical democratic thinking..... 14 million illegal aliens are a drain on our economy ...doesn't matter their race....I don't care if they're white....how many terrorists have crossed over the border already.... Terrorists killing anyone that isn't their idea of religion isn't racist to want to kill them. Trump wants to fix a problem the democrats refuse to even acknowledge.. That's not racist, it's common sense. Trump doesn't have a problem with women...his big deal was the fight with Rosie O.... Democrats are spinning it to include all women... Abortion has always been a hot topic for 100 years... Who has the right answer? Nobody yet...
As far as Hilary is concerned.... Her closet has more head stones than Arlington.. He will make her look like the snake she is... I'd be ok with trump sanders ticket...he'll get his votes and still be able to control him..anything to beat Hilary...

Bigdog it is both parties fault that the immigration problem isn't solved. It could have been two years ago when we had a chance to pass comprehensive immigration reform, the gang of eight. When that fell apart our best chance to get a grip on the problem slipped away. The reason undocumented workers come to this country is because of jobs. The Republicans are fond of pointing out that Democrats don't create jobs, conservative small and medium size business's create jobs. They are the ones breaking our existing laws and hiring the migrant workers. They do this to keep unions in check and keep wages stagnate, they have been successful now for 40 years. They use the threat of foreign workers to their own purpose and in the process make our border unsafe. If the laws on the books were properly enforced there would be no mass migration, the reason for coming jobs would be eliminated.

Trump has made several unwise statements in his primary races and now the effect of his hate speech is coming back to haunt him. There is no way Bernie would team up with a billionaire even if they share some positions. Sanders is not for the 1% he is for the 99%. Trump is for Trump plain and simple, he will say and do whatever it takes to win. As has been pointed out Hillary is now 11 to 13 points ahead of Trump nationally, I'm sure that will narrow as time goes on. No one has won the election from that far behind, it will be interesting to see if Trump can pull if off. The only way Hillary will lose is if she beats herself, it is hers to win or lose. There is still the ongoing FBI investigation of the e-mails, if she gets past that, then the conventions it is all open field running for her. Bernie is not about to start a 3rd party and give the win to the conservatives. It still remains to be seen if the Republicans launch a 3rd party bid. If they do and split their own vote the Democratic nominee will then win no problem.

P.S. It was Trump who played the race card to begin with, labeling Mexicans criminals, rapists etc. etc. etc. He has insulted just about every group including women, and has actively engaged in the most blatant form of playing the fear card of any political hack I have ever seen.

[wiseguy]

Why do you say it's a race thing...typical democratic thinking..... 14 million illegal aliens are a drain on our economy ...doesn't matter their race....I don't care if they're white....how many terrorists have crossed over the border already.... Terrorists killing anyone that isn't their idea of religion isn't racist to want to kill them. Trump wants to fix a problem the democrats refuse to even acknowledge.. That's not racist, it's common sense. Trump doesn't have a problem with women...his big deal was the fight with Rosie O.... Democrats are spinning it to include all women... Abortion has always been a hot topic for 100 years... Who has the right answer? Nobody yet...
As far as Hilary is concerned.... Her closet has more head stones than Arlington.. He will make her look like the snake she is... I'd be ok with trump sanders ticket...he'll get his votes and still be able to control him..anything to beat Hilary...

Bigdog it is both parties fault that the immigration problem isn't solved. It could have been two years ago when we had a chance to pass comprehensive immigration reform, the gang of eight. When that fell apart our best chance to get a grip on the problem slipped away. The reason undocumented workers come to this country is because of jobs. The Republicans are fond of pointing out that Democrats don't create jobs, conservative small and medium size business's create jobs. They are the ones breaking our existing laws and hiring the migrant workers. They do this to keep unions in check and keep wages stagnate, they have been successful now for 40 years. They use the threat of foreign workers to their own purpose and in the process make our border unsafe. If the laws on the books were properly enforced there would be no mass migration, the reason for coming jobs would be eliminated.

Trump has made several unwise statements in his primary races and now the effect of his hate speech is coming back to haunt him. There is no way Bernie would team up with a billionaire even if they share some positions. Sanders is not for the 1% he is for the 99%. Trump is for Trump plain and simple, he will say and do whatever it takes to win. As has been pointed out Hillary is now 11 to 13 points ahead of Trump nationally, I'm sure that will narrow as time goes on. No one has won the election from that far behind, it will be interesting to see if Trump can pull if off. The only way Hillary will lose is if she beats herself, it is hers to win or lose. There is still the ongoing FBI investigation of the e-mails, if she gets past that, then the conventions it is all open field running for her. Bernie is not about to start a 3rd party and give the win to the conservatives. It still remains to be seen if the Republicans launch a 3rd party bid. If they do and split their own vote the Democratic nominee will then win no problem.

P.S. It was Trump who played the race card to begin with, labeling Mexicans criminals, rapists etc. etc. etc. He has insulted just about every group including women, and has actively engaged in the most blatant form of playing the fear card of any political hack I have ever seen.

Bigdog and his ilk hear the hate speech from Trump and take it as an answer to their fears. They are incapable of recognizing their own bigotry and intolerance. Most are extremely gullible or willfully ignorant. These are the characteristics required to be a Trump supporter.