Bigdog wrote:Ladies and gentlemen I give you PRESIDENT TRUMP.....
Don't be surprised Bigdog if PRESIDENT TRUMP is given right back. This election is not so much about Trump but rather the disgust with a two party system in Washington run by global elitists. The forgotten men and women of this country, the ones who lost their homes and jobs in the last great economic downturn in 2009, are the ones who voted last night. The very people who were left behind because of trade agreements and sent to war because of our entangling alliances. The people who were told if you play by the rules you will succeed and then found out all this time they were suckers. There was a rage last night and a vote to voice the rage. The elites of both parties who have abused their trust are now suffering and Trump might not be able to be managed as they have hoped for. Remember he is not beholding to anyone and can do as he pleases, if he is opposed he will simply take his case to the people. He was in favor of single payer health like they have in Europe, he is an isolationist and will not use war as a policy option. He will use his office to stifle political opposition, curb the media and will be in a position to stack the court and uphold whatever measures he wishes to impose. You have to remember that Fascists came about not because they were strong but rather Democracies were weak.
Trump will disavow all of our trade agreements and want a make over on all of them. He will push for all forms of energy production even dirty coal since he does not believe in Global Warming. Already the stock market has taken a dive on news of his victory, his policies what there of them will add to our deficits and he will lower taxes on the wealthy, although he is already probably paying nothing. Him and Al Capone. One thing is for sure if he fails then what? The long awaited uprising of the masses against the ruling elite? If he is successful a monarchy and he passes his crown to one of his sons or daughters?
P.S. Hillary is leading in the popular vote total that is why I dislike the electoral college.
The voters who elected Trump will get what they asked for and they will deserve it. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that they will come to regret their stupidity. The fact remains that he will get nothing done without the House and Senate. I see Democrat led filibusters in numbers exceeding those from the GOP in the past 8 years. I see obstruction coming from both parties. I see a feckless presidency for Trump. I see him cracking under pressure and alienating everyone around him. I will not be surprised if he does not make through the full four years. The saddest thing of all is the embarrassment and shame he will bring to our country.
wiseguy wrote:The voters who elected Trump will get what they asked for and they will deserve it. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that they will come to regret their stupidity. The fact remains that he will get nothing done without the House and Senate. I see Democrat led filibusters in numbers exceeding those from the GOP in the past 8 years. I see obstruction coming from both parties. I see a feckless presidency for Trump. I see him cracking under pressure and alienating everyone around him. I will not be surprised if he does not make through the full four years. The saddest thing of all is the embarrassment and shame he will bring to our country.
So far wiseguy Trump has defied the laws of political gravity. He has ushered in for better or for worse a new way of campaigning using social media. It took all of his powers of self control to stay on message the last 10 days. Now we truly have a situation of Trump unshackled as he likes to put it. You have to remember he is not really a true Conservative, like lying Ted pointed out. Rather he is really a Democrat/Populist/Nationalist/Isolationist. Even his slogan of the forgotten man and woman is something that originally was coined by FDR during the Great Depression. True Conservatives will have to abandon their positions on free trade for protectionism, Trump is for expanding the social safety net, single payer health, shoring up Social Security and Medicare. After all the older white vote is what put him over the top. He is probably going to start this country on a long over due building spree, making our infrastructure over, since interest rates are low and it is a way to put everyone to work that wants to work. A massive public works program like we had in the 1930's. With great power comes great responsibility, it will be interesting to see if he can rise to the challenge that awaits him. I don't really think it matters if both parties are against him since his purpose was to blow up the current system, at least that is what his protest voter turn out was all about. We have to stop thinking in terms of a football field type of political system with most politicians near the middle of the filed. Rather it is more of a dividing line between the have and have not portions of our country. This is something that both Trump and Sanders tapped into with their populist messages.
It's nice to see you're an optimist... but then what choice is there? There is also the chance that this will bring the Republicans and Democrats together in a common effort to prevent Trump from doing too much damage. Finally bringing back the art of compromise that has been missing for so long. Without their support it really doesn't matter what Trump wants to do.
I will no longer be referring to Trump as con man Don. Like it or not he is my president now.
I told you all before that both parties are out of control. Each is too far from the middle which is where we need to be. I certainly hope that happens now. Each party has had a wake up call that the NORMAL American people are sick of the politics, the favoritism , the greed and the total mess created by the the current commie agenda. Every failed Obama decision, law, executive order, lie, Obamacare, his opening days worldwide apology tour telling the world we were wearing panties as a country... The open unfettered Mexican border...Obamas legacy is going to be one of complete failure. He hurt this country more in his time and sent us backwards farther ...and the country was sick of the clintons, well NORMAL people were..... We need to get back to the country George Washington fought for and led. I'm sick of the far left and far right.
Starting very shortly an investigation of the Clintons, the FBI leader, the attorney general and many others needs to begin. Abnormal stuff went on and I'm guessing much of it illegal. Start construction on the Great Wall of Mexico and start the deportations. Clear the illegals off our welfare and SS and food stamp freebies... Take back the country from the democommies failed policies... NORMAL Americans have spoken. The status que is over. Thank GOD.... America that we grew up with is coming back...the good high paying jobs are coming back then we don't need a rediculously unaffordable minimum wage. It's a job and business killer and those jobs are usually first jobs, transitional jobs and were never ment to be your lifetime job but since NAFTA and other stupid trade agreements and corporate greed that sent our jobs to other countries raising mimumjunm wage was the magical fix...WRONG...the last eight years were a TOTAL disaster of major proportions and this is the result..NORMAl Americans are going to get our country back from the brink of total collapse and failure. Thank God there are more NORMAL people than brainwashed dope smoking commie loving, coolaid drinking idiots that want a different direction.
Bigdog wrote:I told you all before that both parties are out of control. Each is too far from the middle which is where we need to be. I certainly hope that happens now. Each party has had a wake up call that the NORMAL American people are sick of the politics, the favoritism , the greed and the total mess created by the the current commie agenda. Every failed Obama decision, law, executive order, lie, Obamacare, his opening days worldwide apology tour telling the world we were wearing panties as a country... The open unfettered Mexican border...Obamas legacy is going to be one of complete failure. He hurt this country more in his time and sent us backwards farther ...and the country was sick of the clintons, well NORMAL people were..... We need to get back to the country George Washington fought for and led. I'm sick of the far left and far right.
Starting very shortly an investigation of the Clintons, the FBI leader, the attorney general and many others needs to begin. Abnormal stuff went on and I'm guessing much of it illegal. Start construction on the Great Wall of Mexico and start the deportations. Clear the illegals off our welfare and SS and food stamp freebies... Take back the country from the democommies failed policies... NORMAL Americans have spoken. The status que is over. Thank GOD.... America that we grew up with is coming back...the good high paying jobs are coming back then we don't need a rediculously unaffordable minimum wage. It's a job and business killer and those jobs are usually first jobs, transitional jobs and were never ment to be your lifetime job but since NAFTA and other stupid trade agreements and corporate greed that sent our jobs to other countries raising mimumjunm wage was the magical fix...WRONG...the last eight years were a TOTAL disaster of major proportions and this is the result..NORMAl Americans are going to get our country back from the brink of total collapse and failure. Thank God there are more NORMAL people than brainwashed dope smoking commie loving, coolaid drinking idiots that want a different direction.
Once again Bigdog there is no middle, the middle was the status quo. This was a vote to repudiate the status quo, Hillary was pushed to the left by Sanders and Warren, Trump pushed to the right to capture the Republican base. Both parties in principle supported business as usual, and both have really lost as far as the people are concerned. We are no longer dealing with a vertical line that divides left and right. What we have is a horizontal line between the elite profiting from globalization and technology and the majority that was left behind. Technology is eliminating the last few jobs that pay a decent wage, pretty soon trucks will be driven automatically and even your fast food will be fully automated. Trump was actually nice to Hillary last night, it would be bad public image to kick someone when they are down. He doesn't want to bring any attention to her since that would only make a martyr out of her. The last thing he wants to do is appear vindictive to the defeated. He might build the wall to provide employment to workers, but Mexico is not going to pay for it. One power Congress does maintain is the power of the purse, while they will provide money for a wall, they will not pay the 100's of billions of dollars it will take to deport 11 to maybe 20 million people. People who do the work others won't and are needed for the economy to function. Don't think for a moment that Trump is going to go along with the Republican middle script, he has already declared war on House Speaker Ryan, and the Democrats in the Senate can be just as obstructionist as the Republicans have been for the last 8 years. Trump can blow up everything just like the voters who elected him want him to do. You are still thinking that the Washington elite are going to control the mob, if they try he will take his case to the people and send the special interests packing. That is why you have to be careful for what you wish for sometimes you just might get it.
wiseguy wrote:It's nice to see you're an optimist... but then what choice is there? There is also the chance that this will bring the Republicans and Democrats together in a common effort to prevent Trump from doing too much damage. Finally bringing back the art of compromise that has been missing for so long. Without their support it really doesn't matter what Trump wants to do.
I will no longer be referring to Trump as con man Don. Like it or not he is my president now.
If the Republicans and Democrats gang up on Trump, it will be playing into his narrative that the system is rigged and against him. That the establishment is trying to steal his mandate and that he is a true man of the people, unable to be corrupted by the current rotten and decayed political environment in Washington. He has the money to fly his own jet and can hold rallies getting his supporters to bring pressure on elected officials, he loves the limelight and thumping his nose against convention. After all one of his campaign promises is to "Drain The Swamp".
The stock market slapped Obama, Hillary and the rest of the democommies right in the face....breaking a record...Obamas legacy is one of stagnation and failure. The democrats don't have to work with the republicans we outnumber them....just like they rammed Obamacare up your butt...the republicans have control of the reamer now....so bend over...it's coming...
Mexico will pay for the walllll...not outright were not going to send them a bill....they will pay from higher tariffs for not controlling their people..and items they want to import.....I don't care how much it costs to send them back they are draining our economy with freebies....every able bodied person than can work should not get anything free...work or die ...the only people working in America can't sustain all these freebies for lazy freeloaders ...just so they will vote for the democommies.... Get a job or move out of the country...I support myself and family so should everyone else... No more freeloaders of any color. I'm not willing to pay higher taxes to support able bodied freeloaders.
Bigdog wrote:
Mexico will pay for the walllll...not outright were not going to send them a bill....they will pay from higher tariffs for not controlling their people..and items they want to import.....I don't care how much it costs to send them back they are draining our economy with freebies....every able bodied person than can work should not get anything free...work or die ...the only people working in America can't sustain all these freebies for lazy freeloaders ...just so they will vote for the democommies.... Get a job or move out of the country...I support myself and family so should everyone else... No more freeloaders of any color. I'm not willing to pay higher taxes to support able bodied freeloaders.
All Trump will do trying to raise tariffs is stifle trade and cause another recession, this time globally. Mexico is not going to pay for the wall that is just a pipe dream that the Republicans having been smoking for years. Neither party wants to pay to send all of these people back especially since without their labor the very food you and your family eat would not be harvested. You may not be willing to pay higher taxes for free loading, but you would have to raise taxes to deport these people. Unless of course you are gong to do the same old tired Republican trick that they use to wage war. Declaring war and not raising taxes to pay for it, just put it on the old credit card and slap a few more trillion on the national debt. These guys are the real freeloaders. Them and the big banks that caused the financial meltdown back in 2009. You need to wake up yourself and smell the coffee, things are not going back to the middle, we are not in Kansas anymore Toto.
Oh and the reason the stock market rebounded is the weasels on wall street figured out how to make a buck. If you look at the stocks they invested in it was Construction and Health Care. That was because they are betting Trump will increase government spending on infrastructure and if Obamacare is repealed, it has to be replaced by something. The 20 million people who now have coverage will not be willing to go back to no coverage. It is much easier to set a government program up than it is to totally eliminate it. Also the Democrats picked up two seats in the Senate and will be using the Republican trick of blocking any legislation or nominations that they don't like, checkmate.
One thing this election has revealed to me is this "Myth of the Middle". What is the middle in this country? All this talk of middle class, middle of the road politics? Who decides what the middle is? Why are people who describe themselves as Moderates disliked by the extremes and are seen as being weak? Is the middle a place defined by the elites of both sides, who like the status quo, and don't want things to change? Why would they? Everything is to their collective advantage they have the power the wealth, the majority of us struggle by and in the end hope for a decent burial. This is why both parties are given money by the elites so that the status quo is perpetuated. Is the middle a safe haven for those of us who realize that only a few can be elites and don't want to admit that we are losers? After all isn't that what this country is all about winners and losers? We are made to feel bad because we haven't achieved the top rung.
Why should we feel bad? When now it is revealed by this election that we are playing on an uneven field, that the deck is stacked against you from birth, unless you are born into the elite class to begin with. It has often been said that we do not have a class mentality like other parts of the world. Is that really true? Our class system is based on wealth rather than social standing or education. What is putting the strain on society is a global change that none of us can control. We are moving from the Industrial Revolution to a Technological Revolution. Just like there were winners and losers when we went from a Farm based economy to an Industrial one. The difference is the change was made gradually over a couple of hundred years from Farm to Factory, before WWII about half of the country still lived on the Farm. This Tech Revolution has happened in a much shorter span of time and the dislocation has been greater. With the Tech Revolution and Globalization has come the shutting down of the Industrial Revolution in this country. Those workers who lost their jobs have not been able to be retrained since they have the skills for the old jobs not for the new ones.
Which brings us back to this election. It has in a way pulled back the curtain of how our society functions, and it isn't a pretty sight. That is why the people voted to drain the swamp. They see that they have been sold a bill of goods by the elites. The special interests whose lobbyists corrupt and defile our political system. The industrialists who profit from our military spending and endless wars. The special interests who keep our Medical Costs the highest in the world. The big banks and wall street who have to be bailed out by the taxpayer for their gambling. The very groups that want to shred our Social Safety Net and keep workers from getting the benefits that they have worked all their lives for. The fault is not in the elites since they are the winners and have taken advantage of the situation. The fault is with the rest of us who allow this system to continue. Through our willingness to put up with this status quo, this so called middle of the road. Where does that road lead to? The same place it has lead to for thousands of years, a few winners living well and the masses struggling to their graves.
It has come to my attention that the rules of the electoral college make possible a different outcome. It has happened before but never in a way to effect the result of an election. The electors meet in their various state capitals and cast their vote for the next President. They are not bound by the results of the vote and can cast their vote as they please. This means if they decide to choose Hillary it would then be up to Congress to confirm the results. What would be the basis for that to happen? It could be argued that she won the popular vote and she is the choice of the majority of the people. You must remember when Hamilton and Madison came up with the electoral college, it was meant to protect the elites from the masses who might vote for someone they didn't approve of. The reason the electors hold their meetings in December is to give them time to decide if the President elect meets with their approval. Right now you see Trump is playing it cool and will continue to do so until after the electors have met. Already there is a petition with 600,000 signatures on it calling for the electors to vote for Hillary. If this were to happen I'm sure Trumps supporters would be up in arms literally. This whole issue might cause a Constitutional Crisis that could result in an Amendment revoking the electoral college, and making the office of President like all other offices, determined by the will of the people, the vote. This has been a crazy election cycle, with all of the protests I'm just wondering if we might have one more surprise in December?
I know this is the longest of long shots, only 38 electors would have to change their vote. Then they would be labeled faithless electors, but then of course I'm sure they have been called worse. Unlike Brexit this gives us a chance for a do over. Just remember Trump isn't the President until the electors vote on December the 19th.
Trump continues to play it cool the interview on 60 minutes last night was meant to calm the waters. He is trying to say all the right things and is starting to back track on some of his more outrageous comments. The wall might be a fence in some areas. First the border will be secured and all of the criminal elements will be returned to their native countries or locked up. Those two things alone will take so long that mass deportations might not happen during his term? Hillary is not going to jail and has a very low priority since going after her would look cheap and petty. Jobs are going to happen because of massive spending on infrastructure, his own version of the "New Deal". Certain things like global warming are going to suffer, regulations are going to be cut, and coal production is going to try and be revived even though those jobs are going to be automated if they do come back. I already have my Medicare and Social Security and am so old that I will pass on before the programs go bankrupt. I feel bad for anyone under 55 years old the cut off. They will have to deal with programs the Republicans want to privatize and get the government off the hook financially. I guess I could take the attitude I got mine, and to hell with everyone else, but then that would make me a tea bagger which I'm not. Refugees can forget gaining admission to this country since the vetting process will become so convoluted that it will take forever for any of these people get admitted. One area Trump might be good in is withdrawing from our alliances and try to pull back on our tendency to wage war as a matter of furthering national policy. He even seems to be dialing back on a redo of our trade deals, since Ryan and his crowd seem to be for free trade an old Republican policy stand? I'm still waiting for December the 19th to see if the electors will really hand over the codes to The Donald. If they do we can rest in the assurance that we will all go together if we go. The great leveler is death it gets the rich as well as the poor.
The hits just keep on coming from the Trump camp. Steve Bannon now has a newly created position equal to but not greater than to that of White House Chief of Staff. Sort of an advisor, councilor who is the power behind the throne? If this person has the ear of the President then things could get mighty rough quick. He is not a fan of Paul Ryan, and believes in Economic Nationalism, Steve is against globalization and elites, so this is going to setup a fight between the Trump wing of the party and Paul Ryan's/Mitch McConnell's supporters. Bannon also believes in the class problems we have in this country. Fears about his support of racism elements of the party are also a concern.
Reince Priebus the actual White House Chief of Staff will have his work cut out for him trying to keep these two parts of the Republican party from warring with each other, good luck on that one. Good old Rudy Giuliani wants to be Secretary of State, let's hope he doesn't get us in another war. All of these appointments seem to be working at cross purposes to what Trump ran on. Then again since Donald doesn't have much experience and many dislike him in his own party, he has to get help where ever he can find it. I just hope he isn't looking for love in all the wrong places?
I can't for the life of me figure out why West Virginia elected another democrat governor after they killed the coal industry which is a big part of their economy...guess they like being unemployed...
Hillary ran out of people to blame for losing....she started digging up dead people...I guess if they can vote for her they can get the blame too....
The governor of Virginia that pardoned 60,000 felons so they could vote needs to be tarred and feathered and run out of town. If I voted for him I'd be livid....now all those yayhoos are going to need to rob people to survive....
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Don't be surprised Bigdog if PRESIDENT TRUMP is given right back. This election is not so much about Trump but rather the disgust with a two party system in Washington run by global elitists. The forgotten men and women of this country, the ones who lost their homes and jobs in the last great economic downturn in 2009, are the ones who voted last night. The very people who were left behind because of trade agreements and sent to war because of our entangling alliances. The people who were told if you play by the rules you will succeed and then found out all this time they were suckers. There was a rage last night and a vote to voice the rage. The elites of both parties who have abused their trust are now suffering and Trump might not be able to be managed as they have hoped for. Remember he is not beholding to anyone and can do as he pleases, if he is opposed he will simply take his case to the people. He was in favor of single payer health like they have in Europe, he is an isolationist and will not use war as a policy option. He will use his office to stifle political opposition, curb the media and will be in a position to stack the court and uphold whatever measures he wishes to impose. You have to remember that Fascists came about not because they were strong but rather Democracies were weak.
